Interview with famous industrial design experts

In this interview, a series of interesting questions and answers on China's industrial design and the current situation of Chinese brand building were conducted based on the results of the recent design survey conducted by "CEConline". As the former chairman of the International Graphic Design Association, the overall impression of the interviewee is that the design demand in China is huge, the service is scarce, and the design investment is relatively low. Most local entrepreneurs think that design is packaging, and have not yet formed a corporate design strategy. Development plays a positive role in promoting. At the same time, the respondents believe that Chinese companies do not have enough knowledge and long-term strategies in terms of branding. During the whole interview process, the interviewees were involved in the industrial design process of the enterprise, the formulation, application and management of the design plan, the nature, construction and management of the brand, the relationship between the brand and the design language, the relationship between the corporate image and the corporate brand, and the establishment of Chinese brands. It gives pertinent explanations and suggestions that not only have theoretical depth but also guide practice.

CEConline: Nice to see you again, Mr. Grossman. We had a preliminary conversation in early June and exchanged a lot of ideas about industrial design and branding. Based on the imitation and borrowing characteristics of Chinese enterprises in the early stage, the primary problem facing China's manufacturing industry is its own innovation ability, and there is no doubt that industrial design has an indispensable driving force to move from Chinese manufacturing to Chinese brands. China's industrial design has been developing for 30 years and will gradually enter a new historical stage. We can feel that this is the time for more new awareness of the nature, value, purpose and effect of industrial design on a society-wide scale. We all know that you are an expert in this field and have a lot of experience, so now I would like to ask you to share some of your perspectives with our readers. First of all, what do you think of China's industrial design and the current situation of China's brand building?

David Grossman: It should be said that I am not too familiar with many specific issues related to Chinese industrial design and Chinese brands. But I'm intrigued by your recent survey and findings on design by CEConline: What do Chinese manufacturers think about industrial design? How do Chinese companies carry out the process of industrial design? What specific plans do Chinese business owners have in industrial design? I think this kind of survey is very good, the results are also very interesting, say a lot of questions. I have been to China many times, and my overall impression is that the demand for design in China is huge, while the design services are scarce. To make up for it, the design has not yet played a positive role in promoting economic development.

CEConline: Indeed, while "Made in China" has attracted worldwide attention, there have also been a series of confusing intellectual property disputes, anti-dumping lawsuits and the proliferation of inferior products. and other issues that continually urge us to re-examine our understanding of industrial design. Do you think Chinese entrepreneurs' understanding of industrial design is correct?

David Grossman: Design is the practical application of intent, the process by which people create visual, physical, and spatial environments. It is a professional act. The professional services provided by designers have a crucial impact on the development of enterprises. I think that in China, most local entrepreneurs have a superficial understanding of the word "design", which leads to too obvious solutions and insufficient R&D work. The survey results of "CEConline" show that most Chinese enterprises carry out design work on the basis of projects, which means that they will not consider the long-term strategic design direction. At the same time, the survey shows that when each design project is launched, 90% of enterprises will hire multiple designers from outside to serve the project, which shows that in China, most local entrepreneurs think that design is packaging design or product design. Package. As a result, the most likely scenario is that it is difficult to maintain a coherent design language for those projects that are outsourced to different designers. In the end, you may get a product that satisfies you, but cannot form a so-called corporate design strategy at all. Also, you are wasting resources because every project has to be run from scratch.

"CEConline": Yes, industrial design should be specifically the process by which companies create new products and innovate existing products in order to better meet the needs of the public and consumers. It is an organic process of product development. It is also the only way to effectively improve the brand status in the market. Developed countries that attach importance to industrial design generally believe that although industrial design requires necessary costs, it can achieve stronger market competitiveness with high efficiency. It seems that we are not doing enough here. What advice can you give to the industrial design process of Chinese enterprises?

David Grossman: I found through your design research that high-level design decisions in China are made by non-designers. 67% of the design decision makers were engineers or project directors. And I think in general, these people may not have received the necessary professional training for corporate design, and their decisions are likely to reflect only the short-term project interests, rather than the long-term interests of the corporate brand as a whole. I also learned from the survey results that most companies are using their own in-house designers,

which may mean that such designs are not good designs. Because few companies have the strength to let their own in-house trained industry designers take over the design of infrastructure. Usually, companies with such strength are large companies such as Philips or Siemens. However, most companies are unable to achieve such a design business, on the one hand because of financial budget problems, on the other hand because of the lack of truly powerful design talents in the industry.

Also, 41% of people in the survey said they had already started product design before deciding what product to make—the "correct answer" and a high number of people who chose this correct answer. But what do they mean by this answer? If their so-called "product" is just another product with a slightly changed appearance, then such an answer is not really the "correct answer". The company's focus now is not to design a new version of an existing product, but to design a new production line.

CEConline: Do you think that the Chinese business community has begun to pay attention to industrial design?

David Grossman: Design seems to be everywhere these days, it seems like everyone is talking about it, everyone is doing it, and it's getting a lot of attention and a lot of discussion. But I feel that in China, the government recognizes the importance of design, but there is no clear implementation plan. Businesses are also aware of the importance of design, but do not yet know how to use or manage "design". I also found from your answers to the questionnaire that Chinese entrepreneurs attach great importance to design work. Because in principle, they also know that the launch of innovative products is inseparable from design, and 61% of the survey participants believe that design is very important. However, they also said that the design time for each project is 1 to 2 months, which is too short for a truly decent design.

I also found that in China, since most entrepreneurs think that design is packaging design or packaging of products, they want such design services to be fast and cheap. If you put some of the questions in the survey together, it turns out that most companies with less than $100,000 in design budgets run an average of 5 to 8 design projects per year. That means the average investment per project is less than $10,000. So what they're doing right now is limited to changes in appearance and packaging. This approach will not achieve innovation, neither will it reposition an industry, nor will it develop a new market with huge potential.

I think China's misunderstanding of design stems from the history of "copying" OEM. Manufacturers find that the cost of a product is only $0.10, while a well-designed product can sell for $1.00. They cannot imagine that the design of the product plays a crucial role in the price of the product. They believe that design should not have such a high value, which may be partly due to their belief that design is just a superficial product design of the packaging type. Because of such design misunderstandings, when they can't find a design breakthrough that would allow them to raise the price of their product, a vicious circle of imitation among most companies is created.

Of course the survey results also show that 23 companies spend more than $1 million on design. With such an investment, some fundamental changes can really be made. But where is the money spent? If they spend that budget on too many products, they won't get the best results in terms of long-term brand value, because not only will it not reposition the market, it's more likely to continue to fall into In the stalemate of just constantly changing the appearance of the product.

CEConline: What do you think are the advantages and disadvantages of trademarks and designs in China's electronics industry? How do these strengths and weaknesses compare with the branding and design strategies of their Western counterparts?

David Grossman: Actually, I'm not very familiar with the details of Chinese electronics brands. So it's hard for me to make a comparison.

CEConline: Last time we talked, you mentioned that many Chinese companies haven't noticed that owning a brand is not the same as owning a good brand. So can you talk to us about how you feel about having a good brand in a situation like this?

David Grossman: What I'm trying to say is that everything has a brand, everyone has a brand, and even if you don't feel the brand, it still exists. A brand is a perception of a product's image. Everyone who exists as an individual has a brand in mind. All businesses have their own brand and will spend money to build it, even if the effort is silent. Since brand perception of a company is so important, especially for a company that relies on consumers, if a company does not have a long-term consistent brand strategy, its brand will not cause much repercussions, so Lost development opportunities, resulting in financial losses. Also, brands are difficult to "fix" and correct. Therefore, the longer a company does not have effective brand management, the more financial expenditure and time it will take to restore the brand.

CEConline: So for now, what do Chinese companies need to do in order to move in the direction of a good brand?

David Grossman: The importance of brand strategy should be recognized first. Frankly speaking, China used to be an important processing place for the world's commodities. In the long run, with the rapid increase in production costs, this approach is not a good development strategy. Today's consumers expect every product to be carefully designed, and often, if a product's logo is removed and it is placed alongside other products, no one can tell them apart. So it is difficult to design a unique new product. That's why we say that good design has less to do with a particular product and more to do with the company that made it - which is why we say that a business's design is tied to a brand.

However, considering the current situation in China, if you ask the president about the design, he may think that you are talking about the appearance of a certain product, and the topic of appearance is not the focus of his attention. But if you're really talking about brands, it can have a profound impact on the business. Martin Roll says 60-75% of the Nasdaq's market capitalization is about corporate brand equity, not financial performance as most people think today.

China's CEOs must understand that one of the scariest rhetoric is "I'll have my own brand when I'm strong enough." Everyone has a brand concept, even if they never realize it exists . Correcting a wrong brand is much harder than starting a new one from scratch. At present, most Chinese corporate brands are just beautified corporate identification symbols. Only in this way will some PCB manufacturers copy the "built-in Intel" advertising slogan. Another example is Li Ning Sporting Goods Co., Ltd. As far as I know, they put forward the slogan of "build an international brand first, and then develop the international market", but there are many problems. These companies are trying to break into new markets where they are still relatively unknown. Therefore, it is difficult to enter a new market, because you must gradually integrate your corporate image into something that carries the color and connotation of that market, or even completely separate from the cultural environment in which your brand grew up and integrate into a kind of It is only possible to enhance the competitiveness of the brand and expand the international market by entering a new cultural atmosphere.

In short, every business needs a design strategy, which is an important role for the CEO. We should recognize the importance of brand strategy, establish the company's brand strategy responsibility system, formulate long-term brand strategy, implement and continuously upgrade brand strategy.

CEConline: Sometimes we find it difficult to grasp the brand. Could you tell our readers about the brand concept in your mind?

David Grossman: Put some Apple products on the table and we can instantly recognize them as Apple products even without the product logo. Likewise, a set of unbranded Brown kitchen items was placed on the table and we were able to identify it. What's even more interesting is that the iPad was a huge success before people saw the real thing, and that's branding - a brand backed by a strong design language! Brand influence is powerful.

With the development of technology, it has become more and more difficult for products to stand alone, and enterprises must be unconventional from the brand. Look at the iPhone - it has no buttons. Just a bland slab. If in the past, to differentiate one product from the others, the keys and buttons on the control panel could provide multiple individual elements, but today, does that work?

CEConline: A brand is more than just a trademark symbol. So what is the relationship between a company's brand and its "design language"?

David Grossman: Brands are much more than trademark symbols. A company's corporate identity (CI) is also part of the brand - CI translates the company's brand objectives into visual symbols that establish the company's image and differentiate it from other competitors. CI includes the visual design language. Likewise, a company's industry design language is not the same as a product, and it helps to identify the product, which over time becomes a design asset for the company, while also contributing to the effective development of the product.

If a business doesn't have a strong design language of its own, every product they produce will have to be designed from scratch. Furthermore, relying on strong new product designs, rather than strong design languages, makes it difficult to achieve a huge long-term competitive advantage: product designs are easily replicable.

When an engineer (- not a designer) wants to build the world's best (- not the world's best brand) toaster, they think about how to bake bread . However, doing the same thing from the perspective of "design language" is different. Designers are not asked to simply design a toaster. Instead, they should be asked to think about the complete kitchen product line. Ask them to imagine the future of the kitchen: the color and shape of the kitchen, the atmosphere of the kitchen, and the things to do in the kitchen. In this way, you create a possible kitchen pattern with design elements that can be used in every product you make for the kitchen.

CEConline: No way, think about the iTunes/iPod case. Their iTunes/iPod wasn't meant to be a new MP3 player. Because if you launch a newer product based on an existing player, you won't win by design. True design will focus on the nature of the act of playing music. Where will users play music? What problems do they have? What unmet needs do they have? For example, you have hundreds of CDs, but it is difficult to find the song you want to listen to. With iTunes, all problems will be solved in an instant, and in the United States, you can buy almost any song you want to hear, including those that don't have CDs. So, the end result is that Apple has revolutionized the entire music consumption model of the modern age.

David Grossman: Few companies in China have reached this level. Some companies have invested a lot of money in their own brand building, but they often mistakenly equate "corporate image" with the company's brand while investing. One way to be sure that this is the case is to ask yourself, "What is the signature product of Brand X?" For example, a home furnishing company in China's Guangdong Province, they have achieved impressive results, but they already have something like the iPhone that is accurate Is the product identified?

Compared with the past development process, the future development path is much longer. When you're putting money into design and branding, it's important to think carefully about how that money will affect the future of design and branding. When designing a new product, you definitely want to refer to the matrix of variables that affect the product: such as the toaster, the physical parameters of when it bakes the bread, the size and shape of the bread that is common today, etc. However, if your company is designing a family-oriented product line, you must consider how it will benefit the company's future brand value, so the variable matrix should not be limited to just bread, but should include housewives, family Design elements are inside. And this is simply a reproduction of sociology!

Finally, compared to one-off product design, this all-encompassing design approach will become increasingly less expensive and more effective, because the product design language is pervasive, carried over from one product to another. Of course, corporate design languages must also evolve over time, as can be seen in the enduring history of Brown or Philips. Nonetheless, it is relatively easier for them to apply an existing overall corporate design language to the development of a new product than to design it from scratch.

CEConline: So, is there any connection between enterprise design language and enterprise?

David Grossman: Of course, there is a link between corporate design language and corporate identity. Take Apple, in addition to their major breakthroughs in product design, they also have an Apple logo that is uniquely shaped for easy identification. The key is that such a logo not only matches the product design language, but also complements the product design language. This logo is by no means a symbol arbitrarily added to different products that are classified and do not have a consistent design style.

So what does the Apple logo mean? Aside from being a fruit (or rather the label on an old Beatles record), Apple represents the great reputation of Steve Jobs and his unconventional, unconventional spirit. This means the value of the product. Demonstrated impressive market value. What is highlighted is a good brand management concept. This is the brand! That's why an iPhone that costs close to $50 can be priced at $700. This is the language symbol that belongs to the CEO, not just the product designer. The language symbol of product designers stops within the aesthetic framework.

CEConline: How do you think Chinese manufacturers can confirm and strengthen their "design language"?

David Grossman: Recognize the importance of corporate design strategy—of course, this includes forming the corporate industry design language, establishing corporate design strategy accountability, forming a long-term design asset development strategy, and implementing And constantly upgrade the design strategy, maintain a long-term cooperative relationship with professional designers, and form a long-term cooperative relationship with internal and external consultants from the entire operation of the company.

CEConline: China has a long history and culture, and I think you must have noticed the strong tradition of graphic design in China, right?

David Grossman: Graphic design is a form of visual communication. Chinese culture does have calligraphy, printing and painting with a long history of development. But I think China has a strong tradition of graphic design, but it doesn't have a tradition of brand management.

CEConline: Would you like to talk about the design mistakes you see in China, especially in the electronics industry?

David Grossman: For the electronics industry, I can't give too specific examples because I said I don't know the details of the industry well. Generally speaking, I think some companies in China will build a brand on the basis of repeating their existing efforts (-and this is not the right way to build a brand); there are other companies that do not fully differentiate themselves at all. And some other companies can not clearly define their own audience, companies focus on the domestic market or focus on the foreign market, the method of building a brand should be very different. Because when facing different cultures, some efforts cannot be imitated.

CEConline: Under the current circumstances, which electronics companies in China do you think are most likely to create the strongest brand image based on strong design?

David Grossman: I think any business that has a high-quality product at the technical level has a chance of success if it's properly managed.

CEConline: In the West, many companies hire design consultants to create brand identities and produce manuals for the implementation of corporate graphic images. Do you think this approach will help Chinese companies? Why?

David Grossman: A company must have a corporate identity manual (including a logo) to support brand development. In most cases, the manuals are designed and developed by expert consultants outside the company. Any business, anywhere in the world, whether positioned in local or international markets, must do this. Other than that, there is no choice. So, what are the options? Who can choose to make decisions and design. Because there is no company that does not have visual contact with the public, and such a job, I think who can be more competent than an expert?

CEConline: Yeah. Finally, I would also like to ask you to tell our readers what brand mistakes Chinese companies should pay attention to and avoid?

David Grossman: I think the mistakes that should be avoided and paid attention to mainly include the following aspects:

A. Not paying attention to the brand.

B. Does not recognize that a company has a brand in any situation, whether consciously or unconsciously, the financial resources consumed every day are contributing to the generation of the brand.

C. Lack of corporate management accountability in brand management.

D. Does not have a long-term corporate brand development strategy.

E. Don't understand that not taking the brand seriously today results in spending more money on tinkering with the brand tomorrow.

F. There is no enterprise that does not have its own brand. Either have a good brand or have a bad brand. Having a bad brand is a lost opportunity for growth.

CEConline: Thank you for your professional and weighty guidance for our readers. If they can listen carefully and think about it, they will definitely benefit a lot.

Interviewer: David Grossman

Interviewer: "CEConline" reporter Gao Ru

Interview location: "CEConline" Shenzhen Seminar "From Made in China to

Date: July 28, 2011

Interviewer Profile: David Grossman, former chairman of the International Council of Graphic Design Association, Co-Chairman of Israel Design Works (IDW, Israel Design Works), Chairman of Israel Community of Designers (Israel Community of Designers). Mr. Grossman is active in the field of international professional design. He has visited China many times and actively provides industrial design services for Chinese enterprises, and is committed to design promotion project management, infrastructure development and design, internationally recognized design academic courses and experience management, etc. .

Readers can click here to view the results of the Industrial Design Survey, which has been updated slightly as the survey continues.